Rachio 3 Pump Start Function - Troubleshooting / Sprinklers & Irrigation - Rachio Community
Rachio 3 Pump Start Function
post by Crocboy on Jun 2, 2018
Is anyone else having issues with pump start issues? My 3 will not start my irrigation pump from a schedule. I irrigate with lake water through a pump so I have connected terminal M and set the system for this connection, but I get a Fault Zone error message and the pump won’t start.
post by Gene on Jun 2, 2018
Have you connected the pump directly to the M terminal by any chance? Do you have a pump relay?
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
Yes, I am using a Munro MSR24 Start Box that worked perfectly with my Hunter controller. When I replaced the Hunter with the Rachio 3, scheduled runs won’t work. Rachio says the Start Box may be drawing too much power, but Munro says it will work with a very low power draw. Everything is set and connected correctly. BTW, the start box works on Quick Run!!!
post by franz on Jun 4, 2018
@Crocboy I spoke with our hardware engineers and they believe that relay is pulling over 2A to get that fault, which will more than likely damage our power supply. They recommend purchasing a lower current relay.
I’m working with our customer success team on recommended pump relays that draw less power.
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
I talked with Munro and they told me they sell a low power Start Box that draws 50mA. It is model #MPSR242W22. They said the Munro model I was using, the MPSR24 requires 360mA. This information should be made really clear in the Rachio product info as the MPSR24 is the standard box used by a lot of landscapers when connecting pumps. I doubt I’m the only one with this issue. Thanks for the reply.
post by Gene on Jun 4, 2018
Would it be too much to ask for a couple of pictures? One of the Gen 3 wiring and the other of the inside of the relay box? At this point it sounds like there is a short going on somewhere, I wonder if pictures would show any indication of it.
Thanks,
Gene
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
\IMG_2492.JPG](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/2/28740900c12f6c8c62adadf29ecec58f2ba44f55.JPG "IMG_2492.JPG")
\IMG_2480.JPG](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/9/986f973922ecdcf3f81bd378971724412be733b3.JPG "IMG_2480.JPG")
post by Gene on Jun 4, 2018
Not 100% sure how much difference it makes (having never used such a relay box), but official manual shows Common (white) on the left and feed (black) on the right:
\Capture.PNG](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/2/27b4b3526bc98d82a0af9e64c00d748db9f07927.PNG "Capture.PNG")
If there is some sort of connection between the Earth GND and the left terminal, it could explain the short if the common is Grounded elsewhere in the system.
I recommend you try to switch where the Black and White wires are connected to the relay.
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
Will do! And I’ll let you know what happens. Thanks
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
I was headed out to change the connections when I remembered that Munro said the MSRP24 draws 360mA to start the pump and Rachio says the Gen 3 gives an error at 300mA. Munro recommended and Rachio has agreed that I switch to a low-power start relay. I don’t want to damage the Rachio for sure by demanding too high of a load for it.
post by Gene on Jun 4, 2018
Thanks for the update (I’ve missed the part where Rachio would give an error at 300mA). The contact positions would probably not make a difference (they usually don’t in the AC systems).
post by franz on Jun 4, 2018
This is the relay I am being told will definitely work.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/1-2-HP-Pump-Start-Relay-57009/100181554
post by Crocboy on Jun 4, 2018
My pump is 3hp and this relay is for up to 2hp. I have ordered the low-power Munro Start Box rated for up to 5hp. Thanks for the research!
post by Crocboy on Jun 8, 2018
I installed the Munro MPSR242W22, which is the low power pump start relay and had a scheduled run work without the Zone Fault Error! I think the Munro MPSR24 relay commonly in use for irrigation systems using 220v pumps requires more amperage (360mA) than the Rachio 3 will deliver (300mA). The low power relay has a component built into it that lowers its power demand to function to 50mA. It looks like it is working, but the system hasn’t run a full cycle yet of all zones and that will be the real test. I’ll report when that happens. Rachio has been good to work with through this difficult process and has made the frustration, time and expense worth it. We all know now how to deal with this issue.
- Flow Meter with Lake Pump
- Do I have a pump start relay?
- 2 Controllers with Munro Smart Pump Relays. Does it work? Yes / No?
post by Decision-Maker on Jun 23, 2019
Did the controller run a full schedule without errors? I am considering a Rachio Controller for our lake house. Thanks
post by GrantBlair on Jul 8, 2019
I’m getting a zone fault interruption message, and the timer starts, but the pump will not start, so it runs the program, but does not water. It does not happen every time. I can fix it by stopping the cycle, then restarting it using a manual cycle. Getting a little irritating, especially having to wake up at 4 am to see if the system is working. I am learning a lot about the system, however.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 24, 2020
Hi, after reading all this I also purchased and installed the Munro MPSR242W22 and I have a 5hp motor but now I can’t get the pump to turn on now. Any ideas?
post by Crocboy on Sep 24, 2020
I’m sorry, but I don’t know what could be wrong. It works fine on my 3hp pump so maybe check the starter on the pump itself. That Munro relay just accepts the lower mA signal from Rachio and then steps it up to the normal signal required by the pump. That’s my understanding.
post by Thomas_Lerman on Sep 24, 2020
Also, did you enable the pump through the app? Can you tell us more about how you have it all connected (maybe pictures)?
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 24, 2020
I do have the pump enabled through the app. I replaced the munro start box MPSR24 I just wired the same wires to the same places in the MPSR242W22.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 24, 2020
\20200924_201414](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/d/d8834cc85ad84e039a3e375aef0203306999af5f.jpeg "20200924_201414")
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 24, 2020
\20200924_202259](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/2/236503fe22cf58f6006fbe829fce7988b33760f9.jpeg "20200924_202259")
\20200924_202306](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/1/1561a3e9d1c83beff12483372e411b90741952aa.jpeg "20200924_202306")
This is the 5 hp pump
post by Thomas_Lerman on Sep 25, 2020
Good to know it is on within the app. When you turn a zone on, do you hear the PSR click from the relay? Do you have a multimeter that you can check voltages? in other words, when the pump should be on, you should see the 24VAC and should see the 120VAC on both ends. When the pump should be off, you should not see the 24 and only one place with 120. Of course, you should always be careful around especially the higher voltage.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 25, 2020
Looking at the pump lawn controller wiring diagram, it says the largest motor is a 3hp. Could that be the problem? When I ordered the MPSR242W22 it clearly stated that it was compatible with a 5 HP.
post by Thomas_Lerman on Sep 25, 2020
Possibly. When I looked at the spec for that model, it does say 5 HP.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 25, 2020
\20200925_080513](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/f/f9f046284e2fcb1b266d8652ee9294f45a0b5626.jpeg "20200925_080513")
\20200925_080339](https://community.rachio.com/uploads/db1097/original/2X/e/e1cadfe030a78617b781e1679cbcab69ccaa4b46.jpeg "20200925_080339")
After checking power with the multimeter, I always have power going out the pump whether rachio is on or off. I have power on all 5 black wires at all times.
post by Thomas_Lerman on Sep 25, 2020
That does not sound right. How about the 24 VAC?
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 25, 2020
24VAC is working correctly. Thanks for the help. I appreciate it. This is really frustrating and I hope I didn’t burn up the motor. Not sure what to do now.
post by Gene on Sep 25, 2020
The new relay you’ve bought, requires both L1 and L2 terminals to have power, you currently have only one leg of the relay powered. This is likely why the pump is not turning on, contactor within the startbox is not getting the power it needs.
Since the two boxes (start relay & the capacitor box) are nearby, you can simply run a new wire from one of the L2 terminal of the capacitor box (could be L1, not sure which is missing from start relay) and connect it to L2 terminal within the start relay box.
Alternately you’ll have to terminate the second power wire at L2 input within the start relay and run a new wire to the capacitor box where said wire used to connect to.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 25, 2020
Gene,
Thanks for the information. Would I be able to move the wire from the T1 slot (relay box) and place it at L2 (relay box)?
post by Gene on Sep 25, 2020
No, moving the wire from T1 to L2 will not solve the problem, since when the relay is active wire currently connected to T1 should be shorted to L1 terminal, thus there will be no voltage potential between L1 and L2 terminals and you are back to square one.
Try finding where the wire from T1 goes to in the capacitor box (is it L1 or L2 terminal)? You can run a new small wire from the other terminal to L2 within the relay box and that should fix the problem.
post by Jtorres8913 on Sep 26, 2020
That worked! Thanks again for everyone’s help. I really do appreciate it!
post by Arlo-1 on May 11, 2022
I have installed a 3/4 hp booster pump for use with my My Rachio 3, 12 station unit. I have used these units in the past and I am familiar with their operation for the most part. The low voltage wires of the relay are connected to M (for motor) and C (for common) and have been setup in the device setup menu. When I tested this installation the pump relay was not activated. I then disconnected the two wires from C & M and tested the unit for voltage. I was surprised to find that there was 25.4 volts constantly. The 25.5 volts is present whether I have the Rachio 3 set for use with a pump or not. It is still present whether I am running a valve or not. It shows 25.3 volts full-time. If I cycle the unit (run a valve and stop the valve) I will see a momentary ‘hick-up’ in the 25.3 voltage but it is still there full-time. I can only assume that there is something wrong with the Rachio 3 because in past experience the ‘24’ volts AC should come on while running the pump and then go off when not running the pump. Can you please advise me as to what I might do next? Other than this please know how impressed I am with your product line but the season is upon us now and must get this running very soon. I look forward to your reply.
post by Thomas_Lerman on May 11, 2022
I believe ‘M’ actually stands for “Master valve/pump” as it can be used for either, but that is not that important. Which relay are you trying to use?
post by Arlo-1 on May 11, 2022
I have 2 units to choose from: The Hunter Pump Start Relay PSR-22 or the Orbit unit that Rachio recommends. However, at this point I am still wondering if the Rachio 3 unit is supposed to show 24 volts all of the time even if nothing is connected to the unit but a multimeter at C & M.
post by Arlo-1 on May 11, 2022
By the way, thank you for your speedy reply.
post by Arlo-1 on May 11, 2022
Also, the Rachio 24V power supply that was included with the Rachio 3 timer will cycle either of these pump relays when it is used as a simple power supply to trigger them. It seems as though the Rachio’s 24V output for the Master valve or pump might somehow be stuck in the ON position. I had this happen once before and it was disastrous. The timer closed the valve when it was supposed to but the 24 volts from “M” stayed on so the pump burned up and actually started a small grass fire. I have since learned that it is well worth it to install a motor monitor that will shut it down in the event of dead-heading or loss of water. This is why I am concerned about any issue related to the pump motor feature.
post by Thomas_Lerman on May 12, 2022
I personally use the Hunter, but believe the specs might be a little high for the Rachio. However, I use mine for a water feature that is only on every once in a while. I believe the Orbit has lower draw for the Rachio.
Although I do not use it this way, the “M” should turn on only when a zone is running if enabled in the app. I would try disabling it and see what happens. If it is simply always on, you may need to contact support.
post by HealthyEnergetics on Oct 20, 2023
That’s interesting. I am a consumer who purchased the Munro SmartBox as recommendation on your website the only PSR that has been tested to be safe. I have an orbit PSR as you describe installed. I was going to switch them today. It is probably the correct one. Maybe it will work. My system was struck by lightning. So I don’t know what still works properly.
I am not interested in damaging anything.
Here is the google search by - rachio PSR which type - to see the comment on the site.
Mimi
post by ksterry on Jun 6, 2024
I recently purchased the Rachio Gen 3 controller. The system will run the first time but as soon as I stop and try and restart I get this error - Rachio detected a fault in zone master valve while running a schedule on your Rachio-C3D285 controller. I spoke with Rachio and they said it has to do with my pump start relay. I have a Hunter PSR-52 and they said I should purchase the Munro MPSR242W22. I just want to make sure before spending another $100 that this will fix my issue. Thanks