A Beginners Guide on Understanding and Using ALL THOSE ***** NUMBERS! - Getting Started - Rachio Community
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post by cg2000 on Jun 8, 2021
Got it, thanks. There should be a toggle switch in the app between “irrigation convention” and “common sense” units. Barely any of them make much sense to me.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 8, 2021
Just read this, and this was very similar to what I was experiencing:
post by rraisley on Jun 8, 2021
Gerardv514, the table and graph shows irrigation only occurred on 6/7 and will not irrigate again, should rain approximate what is forecast, until some time in the future. In fact, 6/7 was the only day irrigation occurred, as you got rain on 5/30, 6/3 and 6/4. On 6/7, if it didn’t water, moisture would be below 0%, so that’s correct. A little rain is forecast for 6/9, but if you get no more rain than that, it should probably water again on 6/12.
2 things: You mention your Flex Daily schedule is set to water 4 times next week. Do you mean it’s /allowed/ to water 4 times next week, or that you see it on the schedule? You didn’t post that chart/graph, but based on this week’s average ET of 0.136", I would expect it to water the 0.35" of water every 2.58 days, or every 2-3 days. Of course, next week’s temperatures might be higher, resulting in watering more often. Also, if you’re only allowing Flex Daily to water on 4 days a week (not sure if you are), that can limit its performance somewhat. Always allow it to water as many days as possible.
Second, I notice you’re using Weather Intelligence Plus, rather than a local PWS (Personal Weather Station). The weather reported will be the same, but the rain reported will be different. You may find a local PWS nearer you gives rainfall values more consistent with your location.
post by rraisley on Jun 8, 2021
FYI, this post is by someone in Europe trying to tell Rachio it’s using a US weather station (as info for Flex Daily is not available outside US/CND), so results or symptoms there may not be typical.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 9, 2021
I think I had saw that it was about to irrigate again and then I initiated a skip, since the ground was so wet.
I’m allowed to water all days, I saw 4x’s a week in the calendar (schedule). I also noted temperatures were only in the 70’s, so the summer heat of 90’s hasn’t even set in yet.
Evidence that the lawn is getting a bit much water (although mostly due to rain) is mushrooms popping up in the lawn.
So I did notice a difference when we had that big rain storm. WIP (Weather intelligence plus) was stating we had .1 of water (I cant recall exact amount so this is an example). I knew it rained a lot more than that so I changed it to a local weather station and the amount of rain stated it was .9 (again another example but it was pretty drastic). For now I set it back to WIP, should I use a local one instead? There is one a block over from me.
post by Linn on Jun 9, 2021
Yes, use a local PWS. Just take a look at it and make sure that it appears to be recording precipitation correctly.
post by Linn on Jun 9, 2021
Unless all your zones are EXACTLY identical, they may water on different days.
post by rraisley on Jun 9, 2021
As you’ve seen, rainfall can vary quite a bit, so I would choose the weather station closest to you.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 9, 2021
I have 2 in my area, one is .14 miles away and the other is .51 miles away. In between the two, the one that is a bit further away appears to report a bit more data such as the UV and solar radiation. Should I still go with the closest one, or use the one reporting most data?
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 9, 2021
Yes, this I am aware of. Just didn’t make sense why zone 4 (example) was doing every other day (resulting in 4 irrigation for the week) despite all the rain we recently received and only about 70 degree temps, also in a some shaded zone.
post by rraisley on Jun 9, 2021
The only data used from local weather stations is the rainfall, so just choose one that seems to be reliable and has rainfall similar to yours. Other weather conditions, such as humidity and temperature, are used for your general area, and are not obtained from the PWS.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 9, 2021
Thank you all.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 10, 2021
Is it normal that the ‘bucket’ on flex daily doesn’t fill all the way when the system irrigates; as indicated for tomorrow 6/11?
post by NCSuggs on Jun 10, 2021
Yes. I’ve seen that as well and consider this normal
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 10, 2021
3 of my 7 zones will irrigate tomorrow. Those (the front) are at a 17% soil moisture level. The back 4 zones are at 28% soil moisture but won’t irrigate till Sunday. What’s the difference considering both are below the 50 depletion?
post by rraisley on Jun 10, 2021
That will ALWAYS be the case. The calculated amount that Rachio puts down, unless manually changed, is exactly equal to the Allowed Depletion value. However, the ET for the day will always deduct from that, so the normal highest it would be is the irrigation amount minus the ET amount.
post by rraisley on Jun 10, 2021
Neither is getting below 50% depletion, which is at the bottom of the line. One zone /would/ go below 50% (0% moisture) on the 11th, the other on the 12th, so they both each water on those days.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 10, 2021
Ah so 0% soil moisture is 50% depletion?
Here is the front zone, which will water tomorrow.
post by rraisley on Jun 11, 2021
It’s confusing. The terminology is confusing, and then the graph seems to contradict that.
Let’s say 100% moisture is a fully saturated area, from the surface down to the bottom of the roots. We want to water half of that value, normally, so when the /actual/ moisture gets to 50% we want to water. This is considered to be 50% Allowed Depletion (50% off of the full 100%). And the default value of 50% makes this more confusing. If it’s only 40% depletion, then when moisture gets to 60%, we would water.
Unfortunately, Rachio’s graphs and tables show only the Allowed Depletion value, normally 50%. When it’s full, it’s 100%, but when the moisture in the graph reaches the 50% allowed depletion, and it’s therefore time to water, the chart reads 0% instead. So the chart always reads the percent of the Allowed Depletion that is left. At 70% actual moisture, there is 20% of the allowed 50% left, so it reads 40% moisture. And if that doesn’t confuse you, you’re a better person than me!
The main thing is to consider the chart as FULL when it’s at the top, and TIME TO WATER when it reaches the bottom.
The Front, today, is at 17% (0.06" water left). Tomorrow, without watering, it would go to 0.06" minus the ET of 0.09" or -.03" (although Rachio never shows below zero - although I think they should). This triggers watering to occur tomorrow, as without it, it would be below zero.
For the Back, today, it is at 28% (0.10"). Tomorrow, without watering, it would go to 0.10" minus the ET of 0.08" or 0.02" (5%), so still above zero, so no watering occurs. The next day it would drop to 0.02" minus the ET of 0.1 or -0.08, below zero, so watering will occur.
It seems to be working correctly.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 11, 2021
Makes sense. Thanks for the insight.
post by Linn on Jun 11, 2021
Just FYI, even though I’m normally a visually oriented person, I normally totally ignore the Rachio graphs and just look at the detail data. It makes a lot more sense to my mind. The graphs just bring up too many questions.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 12, 2021
This isn’t making sense to me. Today zones 4-7 irrigated (back yard some shaded to shade) at 5 am, yesterday z 1-3 irrigated (front full sun).
Currently the moisture levels in the front are lower than the back, as should be because the back was just irrigated this morning. Our weather yesterday was overcast and rain, today is overcast 67 degrees.
On the calendar view it’s showing that zones 4-7 are going to irrigate again tomorrow, two days back to back? Z7 my mostly shaded area, which is 96% soil moist is going to irrigate again.
Why would the back zones irrigate back to back like this, compared to the front which is less soil moisture at the moment and gets a ton more sun?
post by rraisley on Jun 12, 2021
While the zone does say it will water tomorrow, the Z7 chart indicates it won’t water until at least 6/15, 3 days from now, and that seems about right.
I think I have seen the same thing, where the zone says when an upcoming watering will occur, but the chart, graph and actual operation differ. Perhaps someone else knows why they might be different?
post by Linn on Jun 12, 2021
I no longer trust the overview of zones for seeing the days that a zone is going to water. I used to think that doing a refresh of that view would fix it, but not so. Just checked mine using the web interface (refreshed it first), and by the 3rd zone, it already isn’t right. The overview says it’s going to water on the 15th, but the moisture details says it’s going to water on the 14th. And based on observations, I trust the moisture details.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 12, 2021
It has now updated, and all zones will water again on the Tuesday the 15th. I guess everything looks like it’s running as it should, just got to have confidence now and let it do its thing.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 23, 2021
What would cause these calculations to not add up right?
post by rraisley on Jun 23, 2021
They don’t add up because of excessive rain. Rain over and above resulting in a moisture value of 110% is not considered. That is, the maximum moisture can be 110%, which results in your case to 0.49" of water. Anything over that will not change it, as the rain is assumed to just run off.
post by Gerardv514 on Jun 23, 2021
So it appears when I use local weather stations in my area, the rain precipitation is under reported compared to the local weather network. I know it was recommended to use the local weather station, but curious on why the weather network wouldn’t be better? Doesn’t this use more data points (locations) to better average? Wouldn’t it gather from the local weather stations anyway?
post by rraisley on Jun 23, 2021
That’s the problem, it will use an average. Unless you have an average amount of rain, it won’t be right. I’m sure you’ve seen weather forecasts where rainfall for a day varies by a factor of 2 or 3 between areas only 5 miles or so apart. You want a station that gets as close to the amount of rainfall your location gets, normally the closest one.
post by Gerardv514 on Jul 4, 2021
If it took approximately 30 mins for my sprinklers to put down a half inch of water, can I assume that my nozzle inches should be 1 inch per hour?
post by rraisley on Jul 4, 2021
Yes, you can.
post by bubs3141 on Sep 13, 2022
So when I did a catch cup test it said I was putting down .21 in/hr so I would need to water a ton!!. They are 1.5 gpm nozzles. My well only produces 6 gpm which is why my nozzles have to match.
post by only6foot6 on Sep 3, 2024
@rraisley - I know this post is several years old but wanted to say thank you for your detailed thoughts on proper watering setup. I have spent so much time calibrating, configuring, doing catch cup tests (so many times over the years), root measuring, mason jar testing, changing my monthly crop coefficient numbers, etc…. and my lawn still turns brownish in the summer. I have tall fescue and I know the Southern California summers are brutal but I was so focused on everything being accurate and assumed the system would water correctly.
I have always had a hard time justifying changing one of my controller’s variables to make my system water longer when I knew they were all setup correctly. I know how much water my zones put down. I know my soil type. I know my root depth. I know my lawn type, etc….
Your recommendation of changing the crop coefficient is genius. It made me rethink things. I have always assumed the 12 month crop coefficient recommendations that are on the internet were accurate. I guess they are more a guideline and they could be wrong. So I took your recommendation and bumped up the recommended number for September by 10%. Time will tell and it might be too late for this summer but thanks for pushing me outside of the box.
post by Chromedome on Sep 4, 2024
After years of struggling I’m done. It seems in the North Phoenix area, there’s nothing I can do to get my soil type correct and get the flex daily to water correctly. I now have it set to manually water every 3 days during the summer using locally recommended amounts of inches per week.
post by rraisley on Sep 4, 2024
I don’t think soil type is as important as you/they think. All it really determines is how much water your root depth of soil will hold at one time (Available Water). If it’s set too high, water will run off and not benefit the lawn. You should be able to notice that in puddling and runoff. If it’s set too low, it will require watering more often, resulting in more shallow roots but it shouldn’t affect the grass that much.
If you want/need MORE water to be applied to your lawn (i.e. it starts to wilt in hot weather), then none of those factors will help. Increase the Crop Coefficient to make the program apply more water over time. And be sure you have an accurate value for Nozzle Inches per Hour, either by measuring with catch cups or actual water usage over actual zone area. That is critical IMHO, and something many people don’t bother with. And shouldn’t have to, but it is what it is.